Glenn Malkiewicz (00:00:00):
Just what I’ve observed is I feel we need a different approach to retirement planning, where we focus on the lifestyle aspects of retirement first, before we get into the financial or the economic issues around retirement. And the reason for that is because what I’ve seen is a lot of people over time, who live a very well-funded but empty existence in retirement.
Fraser Jack (00:00:24):
Hello and welcome to the Goals Based Advice podcast, where I have conversations with the pioneers of the new world of financial advice. I’m your host, Fraser Jack. I want to thank you so much for tuning in today. I’d also like to thank our supporting partner, advice intelligence, for powering this podcast. You can find the show notes from this episode at adviceintelligence.com/resources. If you’re enjoying the show, then please help me spread the word. Find your colleagues that don’t listen to podcasts and teach them how you find and listen to your favorite shows.
Fraser Jack (00:00:57):
In this episode, I chat with Melbourne-based retirement specialist, Glenn Malkiewicz. Glenn has a very different approach to retirement planning. He believes that retirement is more than money, focusing on his clients’ lifestyle goals and what fulfills them, to get the best life possible with the money they have. We discuss his four cornerstone framework he works through with each of his clients, which is number one, retire to something, not from something. Number two is what are the meaning of the activities or work that you do in retirement? Number three, it talks about solving the couple’s conundrum. Number four is the need to get greater return on life, not just return on investment.
Fraser Jack (00:01:44):
Now, Glenn’s done some alternative studies that you may want to look into. He also discussed the Retire Like A Boss seminar he runs to great success. It’s a long episode, full of great tips and ideas that you can use with your clients. So let’s hit play with my conversation with Glenn.
Fraser Jack (00:02:01):
Welcome to the show, Glenn.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:02:03):
Thank you, Fraser. A real pleasure to be on your podcast today.
Fraser Jack (00:02:08):
Thank you. Now tell us about yourself.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:02:10):
So personally, I turn 40 this year, married, two young kids. So my son, Ashton, who’s five, he’s starting prep next year and I’ve got Calyssa who is two. Outside of family and outside of work, I’m a massive sports fan, have always been, and when time permits, I take the kids mainly to the football. We’re mad Western Bulldogs supporters. So that’s family life.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:02:37):
Professionally, I’ve been advising for 10 years now, and been in the profession or the industry about 12 or 13 years. Degree-qualified, did my Bachelor of Business at RMIT University. I’m based in Melbourne, specialized in financial planning. And here we are today.
Fraser Jack (00:02:56):
Yeah, fantastic. That’s a pretty good summary, good overview. Western Bulldogs supporter.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:03:02):
Yeah. Well, it’s really just three years ago that I really start to promote that now. We eventually got to the top and I was lucky enough to attend the Grand Final which has been my only one. Yeah, an amazing day, very special for me and all the fans that were involved that day, that week and that whole year. So it was magical stuff.
Fraser Jack (00:03:28):
Yeah, fantastic. Now tell us about your journey. You said you’ve been an advisor for 10 years but you spent a couple of years in the industry before that. Tell us about that.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:03:38):
Part of the Bachelor of Business that I did which had the financial planning specialization, there was a what they call a co-op year. That was one-year work experience in a financial planning firm, just to really get to the gist of what this profession’s all about and to see it in real life, which is a little bit different to theory. So I did that at a firm called Morrows. Was there for 12 months, which was great. So got to sit in client meetings, helping clients with their client data forms, and seen how advice actually works, preparation of SOAs, learning all of that stuff, which was really good.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:04:21):
So that was actually for 18 months, then I went back to full-time uni, finished off my degree, and then took a role as a client services officer, I think they’re called these days. Really learning the administration side of financial planning, setting up investment applications, superannuation rollovers, dealing with the product providers, chasing clients up every single day with all their outstanding requirements, and I think that’s a really good foundation for anyone who’s entering the profession. You need to learn the mechanics of it. Dealing with BDMs and product providers was a good way for me to do that.
Fraser Jack (00:05:06):
Yeah, you’re absolutely right about that foundation thing. I think when I first started as a chef, I started washing dishes and you get a real appreciation for the work that goes on behind the scenes, not just the front. Like you say, it teaches you not to make a mess or teaches you not to use or do things that are not helpful in the system.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:05:29):
Exactly right. So from there, I moved onto a paraplanning role and that’s where you really get to learn about the strategic side of financial planning and the strategies that we employ to help a client. For me, I was lucky enough to be sitting in client meetings with the advisor that was training and mentoring me at the time. So gave me the client exposure that I needed. You’re dealing with real-life situations there, which was great and daunting at the same time.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:06:02):
I always had a fear in my early years that I’d get a question from the client that I couldn’t respond to or I couldn’t answer. But going through that process of paraplanning and producing the statements of advice and working out the right strategies for the client, you run your financial planning software, we were using Xplan at the time, so XTools plus and the projection software’s there. I really learnt a lot.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:06:29):
For most people, I think, that’s the natural progression to becoming an advisor. You’ve got the client support or the administration side first, then you jump into the paraplanning, and then you step into advising.
Fraser Jack (00:06:47):
Now how much easier is it when you’re paraplanning to be have been in the client meeting?
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:06:56):
Yeah, that really depends on the advisor’s ability to take detailed file notes and their ability to communicate the message that they’ve received from the client. For me, being lucky enough to be sitting in the client meetings, you’re virtually hearing the message from the horse’s mouth or the client’s mouth, so to speak. So for me, you’re much more informed. So potentially, you don’t miss anything, that you’re really hearing the reasons the client is there. Which is hard, if you’re just reading a client data form that’s been completed in that meeting by the advisor, which is virtually just facts and figures and numbers and that kind of stuff, you’re not really finding out the real reason the client’s there. So being able to sit in those client meetings, it really allowed me to personalize and tailor those financial plans and those SOAs.
Fraser Jack (00:07:54):
Yeah, I see that as an amazing opportunity, to have the plans done when the paraplanner’s in the room, and it’s really hard for paraplanners, like you said, if the file notes aren’t really done really well, then it’s really hard to personalize those SOAs, isn’t it?
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:08:11):
Yeah. I’ve just found even when... because we’ve used the outsourcing services for paraplanning in the past. You’re dealing with people who aren’t even based in Australia. You just compare that, those plans that sometimes get returned to you, compared to one that’s been developed by a paraplanner who sat in the client meeting, they’re poles apart in some cases.
Fraser Jack (00:08:40):
So you spent a fair bit of time then coming through, as paraplanning, and now advising. One of the things that really stands out to me was you decided earlier on, which clients you are best looking after and what you got to be, within yourself, helping people to get their best results. Do you want to talk to us about how you niched your client?
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:09:03):
So it was probably around two or three years ago, maybe four years ago, when I sat down, I think it was over the Christmas break. At that stage, I’d probably dealt with 150 clients from different backgrounds, different age demographics, all with their own unique issues and concerns. I just thought to myself going forward, if I’m going to turn this into a career that I enjoy doing, which I enjoyed it at that point, who are those clients or what is that demographic that I like working with the most? Who are the ones that I feel I can provide the most value to? Who are those clients that are mostly engaged in the process?
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:09:51):
For me, that was the retiree and the pre-retiree clients. So I kind of made a decision there and then to say they’re my ideal client. That’s where I want to set up a niche and really specialize in. So I took it from there.
Fraser Jack (00:10:07):
Yeah. It’s an interesting thing because sometimes people tend to... their best client or the ones they’d like to help the most are the ones that are very similar to them. Like they’re the same age or that similar role. For you, it’s like I’m choosing something that’s different to me or my life stage.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:10:26):
Yes. I do get questions from clients to say, “You look 25. You haven’t experienced retirement. Why should I work with you?” That’s something that I do need to address from time to time.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:10:42):
What I do say to these clients is, “Look, I’ve been advising for 10 years. I’ve made a lot of observations about people who have retired well and those who haven’t.” I can share that knowledge with people and really provide some benefit and value to help them to live a fulfilling retirement. The second point I make is through my own research and training, I’ve reached out to retirement specialists, both here in Australia and worldwide, and gathered a lot of knowledge that can be beneficial for people who are retiring. The third point is, I actually think it works in my favor, is to say, “I am 40 years of age, that’s true. But in 10 or 15 years time, when you’re well into your retirement, it’s very likely that I’ll still be around being your advisor. Whereas if you’re dealing with say, a 60-year-old advisor, he’s probably got five years left in the profession. He’s done.” So I will still be there, for these guys, for these clients.
Fraser Jack (00:11:49):
Yeah, there’s a couple of really good conversations to be had around that, isn’t there? But this is the really interesting point for everybody, that’s with regards to experience is, it doesn’t have to be your experience. Like you said, you’re working with retirees who have been through an experience and you can share their experience as part of your knowledge.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:12:10):
One of the first exercises we go through when we’re having the retirement conversation with clients is to share observations of people who have retired well and those who haven’t. It’s actually one of the first questions I do ask once we get to that part of the process is, “What observations have you made watching other people retire?” They share their experiences and their own observations and I chime in with what I’ve seen and I share my wisdom with these clients which adds a lot of value. That’s just based on my research and my limited experience in the retirement planning space. I’ve really just been doing that part of the advice for four or five years. But I’ve done a lot of research behind it as well, so it’s all formed parts of what we call the Endorphin Retirement Coaching Program. Yeah, it’s based on experience and research.
Fraser Jack (00:13:20):
I was going to mention that actually, next time, around the old retirement coach title. You call yourself a retirement coach. Want to explain that?
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:13:31):
Well, yes, retirement coach is one word you could use, but I guess if we go back a step, I have been working with people, planning for their retirement, also with people who have retired for a good number of years. Just what I’ve observed is I feel we need a different approach to retirement planning, where we focus on the lifestyle aspects of retirement first, before we get into the financial or the economic issues around retirement. And the reason for that is because what I’ve seen is a lot of people over time, who live a very well-funded, but empty existence in retirement.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:14:14):
When you think about it, Fraser, if I’m speaking to a client or say your audience on this podcast, and you mention the word retirement planning, what’s the first thing that comes to mind for you? For most people, the first thing that comes to mind is the money. So based on my training and observations, to me, the sequence needs to change. It needs to change to what am I going to do in my retirement? That’s step one. Then the second step is how much money will I need to do that?
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:14:51):
So with this new retirement coaching or retirement planning approach, it really started taking form, I would say, maybe one or two years ago, when I was working with a new client. This guy had retired around 24 months earlier, and pretty much what he said to me was he was going crazy and he didn’t know what to do. He also said, well, it wasn’t just him going crazy, his wife was going crazy too. What he said to me was, since retiring about two years ago, he had purchased a holiday house in Sorrento, which is a beach town down in Victoria, for the summer months. He’d purchased a holiday house in Queensland for the winter months and he had already traveled three or four times overseas in his first year of retirement.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:15:42):
What he said to me was, he was forced to confront his own sense of aimlessness and lossness and he felt like his life didn’t really matter anymore, that he was going completely irrelevant. This guy had worked as a doctor all his career and he’d gone from helping people every day to suddenly being on the sidelines. So he’d gone from a who’s who to a, “Who’s he?”, and he really struggled with that loss of identity. He said to me that a life of leisure and pleasure and being on the beach all the time and having nothing to do, that he attracted no intellectual stimulation or social value, that he realized he had no purpose in his life anymore. Before, retirement or retirement planning was all about the money. What I say to people, Fraser, is, “You need enough money to sleep at night. But you need enough purpose to wake up in the morning.” This guy, he lacked purpose.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:16:44):
To me, that’s basically what the Australian version of retirement has sold people on. That a life of consumption in retirement is all you need. That living every day in the sunshine and playing your life away, should be enough. But the observations that I’ve made with just the clients that I’ve dealt with, is that a life of consumption doesn’t always satisfy all people. It’s a life of contribution that satisfies. So it’s about finding the right balance between work and leisure in retirement. That’s really where the retirement coaching program, it started from there.
Fraser Jack (00:17:23):
Wow. That’s incredible. I think I’ve spoken to you about this before, but the words that you just said there and that resonated with me were well-funded but empty. That’s a huge part of it, isn’t it? Not fulfilling your life, but making it not empty. Yeah, having that status or identity, losing that status of being the doctor or losing that status of being the person or the known person that does this or that, it’s incredible. I think we’ve talked about it before, about it being the start up a new career, rather than the stopping of a career.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:18:03):
Well, the way you need to look at retirement is if I’m going to retire at age 60 or 65, potentially I’ve got 25, 30 years ahead of me. If you’re going from a life of let’s say you’re working 40 to 50 hours per week, and suddenly stop, a lot of people just jump off a cliff and hope they’ve got a parachute and they’ll land safely and retirement just works out.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:18:29):
But there’s 168 hours in a week that you need to fill. A lot of the observations that I’ve made of people who haven’t retired well is they become bored, they feel isolated, there’s health issues that arise when you’re not engaging in activities. There’s intellectual decline. As we just discussed, there’s loss of identity, loss of structure, lack of challenges and so forth. So we need to address those.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:19:06):
As part of this retirement coaching program that we do, we have four cornerstones to a successful retirement. The first one is you need to retire to something and not from something. It’s important to have a vision going forward with your retirement because one of the key factors with retirements either flourishing or floundering is are you retiring to something or you’re retiring from something? So are you looking backward or you’re looking forwards? I’ve seen there’s the people who retire from something don’t do well in retirement, just running away from a bad situation is not going to guarantee a better tomorrow. So it’s all about part of the retirement coaching program that we do is providing a structure or a framework to help people retire to something. They’re some of the conversations that we have-
Fraser Jack (00:20:08):
Yeah, yeah, that’s a great mindset shift, isn’t it?
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:20:11):
Yep. Yeah. Actually going through that part of the process with the client, I find that’s where the rubber hits the road very quickly, once we start to get a vision of what tomorrow looks like. Once the client decides what they want to do in retirement, we get the story behind that and we implement that into the advice and the plans that we do provide. So we’re really just providing a structure to help clients decide what are those activities that are engaging, energizing and satisfying, that are going to help them live a fulfilling retirement.
Fraser Jack (00:20:53):
Yeah. So a lot of this is getting those post-retirement goals out and agreed upon?
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:20:59):
Yeah. I’ll just bring it up. The more common ones that come up, as you can imagine, people want to travel in retirement. That’s fine, that’s great, let’s get the story behind that so we can... there’s obviously a financial impact of someone traveling. Others want to relax, they want to join a group or a club, the Rotary club. They want to continue learning. That’s usually a big thing. Teaching a minor or might be a grandchild or becoming a mentor is another one. Learning a new skill. Learning a new hobby. Might be renovations at the home. More time with the family. Some people want to continue working in retirement. That can be full-time work, but it can be part-time, or it could be unpaid work, where you’re volunteering. They want to spend more time with friends. They might take on a new challenge. I also push the exercise and health as an important key to retiring successfully. So challenging yourself both physically and mentally. What does that mean for the clients?
Fraser Jack (00:22:09):
Do you bring these topics up with them as in this is a list of things that other people do and then people go, “Yeah, actually, I’ve got some things around each of those.”?
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:22:19):
So usually, when I say to someone, “What do you want to do in retirement?”, they’ll say to me, “Travel. We’re going to travel to Europe for a month.” They’re really looking forward to that. I say to them, “That’s great but what are we going to do for the other 11 months of the year?” You get some blank stares right there.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:22:44):
So we talk about the importance of retiring to something and the amount of time that you need to fill. Yeah, so I will put the list that I just went through before, which I think I covered most of them. That will go up on a screen in the client meeting. So it’s really providing that structure and they look at the screen and the stuff that’s there. They’re like, “Yes. That is one thing that we may want to do.” So it just triggers that, to do that.
Fraser Jack (00:23:13):
Yeah, they’re great topic-
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:23:15):
Even with, as I was saying before, so the first conversation that I would have with clients is, “What observations have you made of people who have retired well and those who haven’t?” The more common ones will be shown on the screen, they’ll go through the list and they’re like, this, this and that one. Get the story behind that.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:23:41):
What usually happens there, Fraser, is the client can list a good number of attributes of things that people who haven’t retired well. They virtually want to say, my work colleague or my brother or sister or mom and dad, these are the issues that they had. They pretty much say to me, “We don’t want to end up like that.” So I’ve got them in the right frame of mind with the retirement conversation.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:24:14):
Step two is what I just went through before. “What is your vision for retirement going forward?” That was those 16 or 24 things I just listed before.
Fraser Jack (00:24:28):
So the four cornerstones are retire to something, not away from it.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:24:33):
Yep. So the need to retire to something and not from something. The second one is we need to explore the meaning of work in retirement, which I’ll discuss that shortly. The third one is we need to solve the couple’s conundrum. What I mean by that is when you’ve got husband and wife, they’re used to working 40 or 50 hours per week, they suddenly retire and spending a lot more time together, that can create some issues, as you can imagine. And the fourth one is the need to get a greater return on life in retirement and not just a greater return on your investments.
Fraser Jack (00:25:16):
Let’s talk about the meaning of work in retirement. How does that work?
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:25:21):
Yeah. So it’s really exploring your relationship with work. What I’ve found is I think this is probably the most powerful aspect of the retirement planning process from the impact that I’ve seen this have on the clients that I’ve worked with. Because a lot of people have never done a self-reflective exercise around the work they do. Just asking the question, “What do you get from your work?”
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:25:46):
So it’s a profile that I go through with clients. The first 10 questions on the profile will ask about the lifestyle benefits that work provides. For example, so the first one is the question is, the lifestyle question’s intellectual stimulation. Between zero and five, does work provide you with intellectual stimulation? Is it social engagement, does it provide you with the enjoyment of compared in fear of working, making an impact, way for learning and that kind of stuff.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:26:22):
So the next 10 questions will then look at the economic benefits that work provides. What’s the reason for you going to work? Is it to maintain your lifestyle? Is it money for extras, you can’t afford to quit work? You just want to have more savings, pay down debt and that kind of stuff.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:26:42):
So there is an assumption that people in their older ages are working just for the money. But what I’ve found when people complete this profile that there’s an aha moment for many of those. They realize that things like intellectual stimulation is important to me, the social engagement, the growth and learning, and so forth. Over, I would say, it’s probably close to 90% of people who end up completing this profile find out that the lifestyle motivators of working are far more important to them than the economic motivators.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:27:17):
So what I then need to do once they’ve finished this profile, is to ask these guys, “Once you officially retire from the workforce, how are we going to replace those lifestyle benefits that work does provide?”
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:27:31):
Just an example on that, I had a client complete this, probably six months ago now, and he came back to me a few weeks back and said based on that conversation and that profile he completed, what he’s now going to do is he’s going to consult for two days per week. He’s an engineer in his chosen field of work, but he’s also going to volunteer to a cause that’s important to him and his family. Which I think’s an awesome story and that was based on the profile that he completed, and realized that work does have some benefits outside of the paycheck that he gets each month. If we want to help people live an engaging retirement, that they’re doing activities that are satisfying, these are the kind of conversations we need to have. For him, he still loves work and he’s done it for 45 years, he wants to replace some of those aspects once he officially retires, so to speak.
Fraser Jack (00:28:36):
Yeah, this is a really interesting... I’m fascinated by, because we treat work, we’re used to saying the word work, but it’s activities, isn’t it? It’s activities and we’re either getting paid for them or we’re not. In this scenario, it’s the activity, that you’re focusing on the idea that the activity is what your purpose could be linked to. Not the income.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:29:01):
Yeah, exactly. It’s all about purpose in life. I find with most retirees, they retire, then you go through that six to 12-month honeymoon period, where you travel, you might play golf three to four times per week and that kind of stuff. But to me, there’s a diminishing law of return on leisure when that’s all you do. At some point during your retirement, golf doesn’t provide the same enjoyment as what it once did, when you’re doing that every single day. So what other activities can we do that are going to provide that satisfaction and that engagement? Having that conversation around work and the lifestyle benefits that work provides can really help clients at some point.
Fraser Jack (00:29:49):
Yeah, so this work conversation, we’re calling it work, it could be activity, it could be restoring a motor vehicle or gardening or something like that, that’s an applied thing that you do every day on a consistent basis?
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:30:07):
I guess with work, we call it work, but if we change the definition as “work” as being an engagement that provides value to others and meaning to yourself. If we look at it that way, that could be anything then. What is an activity that provides meaning to myself and value to others? You did talk about then about restoring an old car or those types of things. Reigniting a hobby that you haven’t done for 10 or 15 years because work and life got in the way. Yeah, that’s all part of it as well.
Fraser Jack (00:30:47):
Yeah, there’s so many things, I guess, that you would see coming up from learning languages to learning instruments to learning. I guess that’s part of the learning, part of it. Helping, volunteering, giving back.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:31:01):
All of those things. All of those things. I’m not here to tell people what they should do. It’s more so providing the framework through the profiles that we do and letting clients decide for themselves. Retirement is a tricky thing. For many people, it’s just an unnatural move in life. A lot of people struggle with that. I say to all clients that, even the ones that are retired, it’s probably going to take you three to four times to get into the right rhythm with retirement. So you’re just going to have to try new things.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:31:42):
Some people do it better than others. Some make a very successful transition into retirement. They don’t need this retirement coaching part of it, they just need the financial advice side of things. That’s okay as well. Yeah.
Fraser Jack (00:31:58):
Yeah, yeah, fair enough. My dad described it as a full-time job with no days off or no holidays from it. That’s it. It’s you, full-time, every day. It’s a thing.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:32:12):
Good luck to your... yep, yep.
Fraser Jack (00:32:13):
You mentioned the couple’s conundrum. There must be so many different ideas and people. You must be going through conversations where people bring things up and then the other person looks at them across the table or takes a glance at them to say, “We haven’t talked about this.”
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:32:33):
So just with that one, I just want to stress here that I’m not a marriage counselor at all. But one of the profiles we go through with clients is understanding the personality. So how are they wired? What type of retirement lifestyle is going to fit that personality?
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:32:54):
So when couples do retire, there is an assumption, in some cases, that they both have the same vision and the same wiring for retirement. But sometimes their personalities are different. So that can create tension. There’s no surprise that there’s a spike in the divorce rate in the first 18 months of retirement because of these sorts of issues. So you’ve got one expectation here, you’ve got one expectation there.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:33:26):
So there’s a profile that we go through which is there to determine, what do you two have in common? What are your differences? How are we going to manage that going forward, so you virtually don’t end up at each other’s throats? So the profile puts them into four... there’s four broad categories of what they hope to experience in retirement, from an individual point of view. So you’ve got leisure, which is all around travel, hobbies and playing golf. You’ve got what we call connecting, that might be connecting with your kids, grandkids, friends, social clubs, community clubs and all those types of things. You’ve got renewing, that might be working out physically or intellectual renew, completing a uni course or something like that. And the fourth area or the category is engagement which is all around working. Might be working part-time or volunteering. So each individual will complete their profile and then we compare the scores.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:34:29):
Just to give an example of that, with my own parents, dad wanted to travel a lot and to play all the time, golf, down the pub, those types of things. Whereas my mom wanted to engage in the community and spend more time with the grandchildren. They were completely opposite to each other. They had their own vision for retirement. I saw that. There were clashes there. Dad wanted to travel all the time, spend all his time overseas. There were grandkids there who were two or three years of age, that was kind of mom’s approach.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:35:09):
Yeah, so we need to work through those issues. It’s not with all couples, but I just want to raise the caution flag to say, “Hey, let’s just briefly touch on this before, so there’s no tension going forward.”
Fraser Jack (00:35:24):
You say you’re not a marriage counselor but this is the basis of it, right? To actually have this communicated and understand from the other person’s point of view what they’re going through?
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:35:37):
Yep. I think it can cause a major change in the relationship if the couple’s not prepared. So let’s address that now, so we’re all on the same page. I’m just there to facilitate that conversation, to ensure the couples virtually have a much more rewarding and enriching relationship together. It’s as simple as that.
Fraser Jack (00:36:04):
Yep. One of the greatest parts of this conversation so far is we haven’t mentioned return on investment. We started talking about the fourth cornerstone, which is return on life, which sounds to me like it’s a Mitch Anthony conversation. So tell us about that part.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:36:25):
The starting point for that is it’s really based on my approach to financial advice, which is not just for retirees, but just in general. It’s really based on my belief that the ultimate use of money is to get the best life possible with the money we have. My belief is that money has no purpose outside the context of our lives and what we’re hoping to accomplish going forward. Having a pile of money is never the objective.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:36:57):
To me, money is simply a tool to help us live our best lives, so when I’m working with any clients, we need to determine what is the life that we want first? So once we’ve gone through that, this is really about using your money in a way to provide you with the best life possible, with the money you have and accumulate over time.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:37:23):
What we’ve done through, with Mitch Anthony’s help and his training, he’s virtually identified 10 aspects of life that we believe are important for retirees and people to be thinking about and to be having conversations about and making conscious decisions about. It’s kind of broken up into three categories of wellbeing, progress and freedom, but there’s 10 subcategories there. This return on life is an index that we’ve created that we get clients to complete initially and when we catch up with them on a six, 12-month basis, they go through the review process. They will then re-complete that profile. It gives them a score. What’s your return on life? Are you using your money in a way that’s improving your life? So they complete that, takes around five or so minutes to do so, and there’s a number of questions I ask on the back of that. Of the 10 aspects that you’ve completed which ones are most important to you right now? Which areas would you like to see more progress in?
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:38:33):
So what we ask about is, in that profile, is so what’s your return on work? There’s two questions in each area. So there’s a financial question and there’s a lifestyle question. So with the return on work question, question one is I feel I’m compensated well, financially or non-financially, for the value that I bring. Question two is I get great satisfaction and meaning from the work that I do. So they will then score themselves, Fraser. They’ll go through each section. So the other ones that we look at is what’s your return on your residence or the house that you’re living in? Your return on achievement in life? Your return on learning? Your return on leisure? Your return on your health? Return on relationships? Return on purpose? Return on your financials? And so forth. So they score themselves. We ask them which ones are most important to you? Which ones do you want to see more progress in? That usually comes with a financial impact. Do we need to direct your money in these certain areas, so we’re helping you live a life that you want?
Fraser Jack (00:39:52):
This is a fantastic conversation to be having, especially in our environment with regards to fee-for-service, fee-for-no-service, what were the fees, what was the return for the fees paid? When we’re not focusing on the return on the investment assets, which is benchmarked by somebody else as well. But this is them scoring themselves and it’s based on their emotional confidence and those sorts of things. They’ll be able to visually see and you’ll be able to visually see their transformation-
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:40:24):
Fraser Jack (00:40:25):
... and relate it back to you paid us these fees and we’ve helped you transform from here to here.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:40:30):
So that’s one of the profiles that we go through. The other one we go through is ensuring that our clients have financially prepared for the transitions or the changes that they anticipate happening in their life going forward. I know Mitch Anthony briefly addressed that on the podcast that appeared earlier this week, but our approach is also we believe it’s important to focus on those significant life transitions that clients anticipate or see happening in the future. Common transitions are purchasing a house, might be caring for an elderly parent, downsizing a home, or the transition to retirement. So these transitions are either going to add or subtract to your wealth, but they’re also going to add confidence or stress to the client, depending upon if they’ve planned for these transitions appropriately.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:41:28):
So what we do, we’ve got a lifeline, so it’s 2019 and it just goes forward. We sit down with the client, we create a we call it a customized financial lifeline for the client that specifies when to begin addressing the transitions that they anticipate happening in their life going forward. We incorporate those into their wealth plans and yeah. Just to ensure that they’re prepared financially for those things that may happen in their life going forward.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:42:09):
I know Mitch said to you. “There’s probably 65 different transitions.” That’s true. When I first heard that, I remember sitting down and thinking, what are the things that happens in people’s lives that you need to plan for financially? I think I came up with eight, which was getting married, starting a family, travel, buying a house, paying down debt, kids, education fees, and eventually retirement. But there’s actually 65 and you put this up on the screen with the client and you just say to them, “Are any of these relevant?” You’ll be surprised at how many different events you need to plan for with the advice. This is life-centered planning down to its core.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:43:00):
Some of the transitions that we’ve got, starting a family, a child getting married, empty nest, special family events that we need to plan for, potential relocation, concern for an aging parent, concerned about the health of the spouse, concern about your own personal health, might be a family member with an illness or a disability. From a work point of view, contemplating a career change, new job, job promotion, potential job loss, starting a new business, purchasing a business, loss of a business partner for people that that’s relevant to. I want to take a sabbatical, that’s another one. You’ve got retirement, which I’ve discussed. Then you’ve got all the financial ones. Buying a house, selling a house, potential refinance of a house, reconsider investment philosophy. I’m concerned about my debt. And then from a giving point of view, do I want to make a gift to a children or grandchildren? Developing estate plan, fund a cause that’s important to me. All those types of things which have a financial impact which, if you’re providing financial advice around the client’s life, you need to address all of these.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:44:20):
So that’s a life aspect of the advice. What is the life that you want? What are the changes that you anticipate happening in your life going forward? And then we do the mathematics behind that and provide the advice and address that. Stuff like insurance and superannuation and investment products and cashflow management advice are just the tools that we use to help people plan for and achieve those changes that they anticipate and they want happening.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:44:52):
So each time, every 12 months or every six months, when I catch up with the clients, we bring out this lifeline again. As we know, life changes, so things that may have been relevant six, 12 months ago, may have changed. There might be new goals or things that we need to address. So it’s always going back to that and it’s always going back to that return-on-life index. Are you using your money in a way that improves your life? Which then goes back to the whole, my philosophy and approach and belief around that the ultimate use of money is to get the best life possible. So it’s all flipped around.
Fraser Jack (00:45:33):
Yep. The 65 things that are impactful moments on their life, do you show that list and people go, all of a sudden go, “Oh, that’s every single one of them.” Or almost all of them? Or at least most of them?
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:45:46):
I’m yet to have a client that said, “It’s missing this,” or missing that. It’s all been based on research that Mitch Anthony has done. He talks about in his studies and his books that advisors should focus on the changes or transitions that people anticipate happening in their life. They’ve come up with a list of 65, there’s probably a few missing, but I haven’t found them yet.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:46:13):
But you show this on to the client and if I didn’t show this list, you would miss some things. The client just wouldn’t know. So this actually triggers the client to say, “Well, that one’s actually relevant. That’s a high priority for me. That’s going to happen potentially in three years. We need to address that today. Or start to address that.” Otherwise, if you ask the client, what are their goals going forward? They can get stuck. It’s almost deer in the headlights, don’t know what to say. They’ll spit something out that sounds good. It’s probably relevant, but this just provides a... I guess you’re facilitating the conversation to help them decide what they want to do.
Fraser Jack (00:47:00):
Yeah, it’s a good structure for them to be able to go, “Oh, yes, I didn’t even think of that, but I definitely want that.”
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:47:06):
Fraser Jack (00:47:08):
Now you mentioned studies and Mitch, obviously you’ve done a few of Mitch’s courses. Do you want to talk to us about those? What you’ve done and how you did them?
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:47:16):
So the first one that I did, it wasn’t a course, and I encourage all advisors who want to look at this life-centered approach more deeply is to actually read some of Mitch’s books. The first one that I did read, this is probably three or four years ago. Because what actually happened is, I reckon about three years ago, I started to really question the value that I was providing clients, especially with the annual review meeting where we would talk about investment performance and how we did against the benchmark, how we did against last year and all that kind of stuff. I was really talking about stuff that I couldn’t control with investment markets. I thought, “These guys are paying me a fee for this and it’s a pretty decent fee, but I don’t see the value in it.”
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:48:06):
So I did a bit of research online, I came across Mitch Anthony and this life-centered approach, grabbed one of his books called Your Clients For Life, which I encourage everyone to read. It talks about this life-centered approach and really connecting with people on a far deeper, emotional level. So that’s where it all sparked for me.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:48:32):
So Mitch, when was it? About 24 months ago, announced that he had put together the Life-Centered Planning Certificate through Texas Tech, which is obviously US-based and an online course. When I saw Mitch was involved in this, I jumped at the opportunity. It’s three subjects, there’s the Fundamentals of Life-Centered Planning, Planning with Emotional Intelligence, and a third subject is called Client Communication and Counseling. So it’s a pretty intense three subject or three units.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:49:12):
Knocked it out in about 12 months. I’ve just finished about a month or two ago. For me, it was just a massive honor and pleasure to complete the course through Texas Tech. What it provided me was a very practical approach to client discovery that puts the client’s life at the center of the conversation and not their money. So I’ve adopted some of the practices or the learnings and since completing that course, I’ve noticed positive results from the program leading to more meaningful conversations with clients and the ability to connect with the clients on a far deeper emotional level. So what I’ve found is the teachings are practical and they are applicable to everyday, real-life client situations, which is great and I’m excited for more future in this profession as a result of completing the course.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:50:11):
So it’ll provide you with a different dialog that you can use with clients in your initial or first meetings to really get a true understanding of why the client is here to see you. What you’ll find in most cases is the motivations for the clients seeking financial advice usually transcend just creating wealth. You find the story behind that. I’ve learnt all of this just through that course that I completed, which is an online course. It is fairly intensive and extensive. So it’s going to take a bit of your time. Working full-time, having two young kids, it was a challenge, but I got through it and I’m glad I did it. It’s been good.
Fraser Jack (00:51:01):
Now the time too when everybody’s course ambitions at the moment are not necessarily around this, they’re around what we need to do for the FASEA requirements.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:51:11):
Yeah, well, that’s next for me. That’s a 2020 project.
Fraser Jack (00:51:15):
Fair enough. It’s unfortunate that the Texas Tech stuff doesn’t count, but anyway.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:51:23):
Yeah, true, yep. No, it was really good and Mitch was down for the FPA Congress which I couldn’t attend due to prior commitments that I had booked myself in. But I made time to, I spent an hour or so with him on the Tuesday or the Wednesday and that was great. That was really good.
Fraser Jack (00:51:44):
Yeah, he’s a very interesting guy to hang out with, that’s for sure.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:51:50):
Fraser Jack (00:51:51):
Now, I wanted to talk to you about some of the seminar stuff you’ve been doing as well, like the Retire Like A Boss seminar and how you’re doing those and where you got that idea and how you went about organizing it all?
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:52:05):
Yeah. That was the first retirement planning seminar that I’ve done. That was about three or four weeks ago. Really, what it touched on, it was a retirement planning focus. So we had three speakers. I was up first, and I just talked about the stuff that we’ve talked about in this podcast today. Virtually just going through in a bit more detail around those four cornerstones of a successful retirement and the approach that we use to help clients achieve a fulfilling retirement. So we spoke about that. We had a person from Challenger, who spoke about strategies that you can put in place to help get access to the Aged Pension, which is a common question that I get asked from my clients. How do I get my entitlements? The third speaker was a lady called Adie and she talked about how she helps retirees sell their home for the maximum price and then purchase a new home that meets their needs as they begin to age.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:53:16):
So I’ve recently had a few clients that they’ve retired, they live in double-storey houses, the kids have moved out, the house is way too big, the stairs are becoming an issue now. So they’re downsizing for that reason. I get her to do that because she’s fantastic. Just actually, for that client also, the reason for moving was they completed the return-on-life index and the question around residency is question one, I feel my home is the right place for me. And they said, “No, it’s not anymore. And this is the reason why.” That was their trigger for moving, just based on that question.
Fraser Jack (00:54:04):
Yes. We had described that on a recent podcast as rightsizing. So a downsizing conversation.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:54:11):
Okay. Can I use that word?
Fraser Jack (00:54:13):
You can, absolutely. It’s not mine. I’m just repurposing all this stuff. People are giving me great ideas and I talk about them.
Fraser Jack (00:54:21):
So what I was going to say in this is so you organized this seminar. How did you put it together and come up with, was it Adie, did you say?
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:54:32):
So Adie Bradley was one of the speakers.
Fraser Jack (00:54:36):
Adie. She would have brought her own clientele along too, wouldn’t she?
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:54:40):
She did, yeah. So I know Adie through a networking group that I attend every Thursday. We’ve done a bit of work for each other’s clients. She jumped at the opportunity. It was perfect for me to have someone like that in the room because it’s coming up. I’m finding, I deal with retirees all the time, it’s a conversation that’s coming up a lot. She could have added a lot of value. Yeah, so I asked her to speak. I asked her to bring people to the room, which she did. We asked our existing clients. We just ran a ad through Facebook Ads, and we picked up-
Fraser Jack (00:55:23):
Did you invite your existing clients?
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:55:26):
Yeah, we did, yeah, yep.
Fraser Jack (00:55:29):
Yep. So they could bring a friend along, I guess?
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:55:32):
Yeah, all of that stuff, yeah.
Fraser Jack (00:55:34):
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:55:36):
We also did the Facebook Ads. So we actually got 33 responses from Facebook.
Fraser Jack (00:55:42):
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:55:43):
RSVPs. About 20 rocked up, showed up. So we thought that was pretty good from a Facebook point of view.
Fraser Jack (00:55:53):
Did you put a price on it? Did you put a charge on there at all? Or you ran it for free?
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:55:57):
We didn’t... yeah, no. We ran it for free. We didn’t put a charge on this one, but what we may do, we’ve had this discussion already is so for future conferences, I think we will put a charge on. Especially for the Facebook people, because it’s a bit hit-and-miss in terms if they’re going to show up or not. And probably a $20 charge just gets that additional commitment. We’ll just donate that to some charity.
Fraser Jack (00:56:29):
Yeah, well done. I was going to say, what were the main learnings out of running a seminar that you could share?
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:56:37):
The biggest concern that everyone has is are people going to show up on the day or the night? So what I would say, definitely invite your existing clients if it’s relevant for them. You can ask them to bring a friend, it doesn’t really matter. Email them to say, “Hey, we’re running this seminar. Here’s the time, here’s the date.” Give them enough time to decide but also call the clients as well. We found our RSVPs really skyrocketed once we got on the phone to those existing clients and got their commitment. Always send a reminder one or two days out to say, “Hey, this is on. Don’t forget.” Yeah.
Fraser Jack (00:57:27):
Yep. How often are you planning on running them?
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:57:31):
We will probably do two next year. We’re going to change the format a little bit. So what I’m planning to do is just have lunchtime boardroom sessions, maybe once a month or once every second month, where we can have up to maybe seven or eight people in the room. It’s a lot more personalized. For people that work in the city, I’m based in Melbourne CBD, they can come during their lunch hours and I’ll just put some sandwiches on. The content’s still going to be the same, it’s probably just going to be me speaking about retirement planning, but I’ll be running those. But we will run at least one and probably two next year, bigger retirement planning seminars. They’re a lot of work, Fraser. They’re a lot of work to set up.
Fraser Jack (00:58:23):
Yep. Yeah, a lot of work but you can also get some great new clients out of them, can’t you?
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:58:29):
But also you can add additional value to your existing clients. I think client retention’s obviously important as well. Yes, so don’t be afraid to invite your existing clients.
Fraser Jack (00:58:43):
Yeah, wow, great, fantastic. Thank you for sharing that.
Fraser Jack (00:58:46):
What are the big plans for you for next year or 2020 and beyond? What are you looking to take the business? What are you looking to work on or focus on?
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:58:56):
So the focus for me will be just growing the business and my side of the business and really starting to promote the Endorphin Retirement Program that we’re about to launch, which will be a change to the website. It’ll happen, I think, this month or early next year. And then really get the message out about retirement planning but Endorphin retirement, which addresses the life component of retirement but also financial side of things. So that’s really the focus for me the next probably one or two years.
Glenn Malkiewicz (00:59:34):
Personally, I want to eventually get to a point, I haven’t put a timeline on this yet, but be known or recognized as a retirement expert in Australia. Just get that message out to just the public in general that retirement planning is more than just having enough money. There’s a life side to everything as well. Based on my research, these are the concerns that people have with their retirement. I just want to address those. So it’s really building that retirement planning part of Endorphin Wealth.
Fraser Jack (01:00:11):
Yeah, nice. If you were talking to a consumer, maybe hasn’t got advice yet, maybe your seminar, what tips do you give them around choosing the right planner for them?
Glenn Malkiewicz (01:00:26):
The tips that I would give for a person that’s potentially looking for advice is speak to more than one planner. I encourage that with a lot of my prospective clients as well. You want to find an advisor that shows empathy, that understands, that’s willing to take the time to understand the client, their story, their situation, the client’s challenges and possibilities going forward as well. So you want to look for an advisor that, you want to find an advisor who doesn’t just focus on investment performance only. It’s almost life-centered planning.
Glenn Malkiewicz (01:01:12):
As I was saying before, life-centered advisor starts with someone who understands you, your situation, your story and the possibilities and challenge ahead of you. You want to find an advisor that has broken away from that traditional financial planning model that has a real focus on products and sales as well.
Fraser Jack (01:01:37):
So it’s about you, not your money.
Glenn Malkiewicz (01:01:40):
It’s all about putting, I guess, a life-centered approach is the conversation changes from a focus on your money to putting your life at the center of the conversation. Which means the process changes from selling, someone who’s going to sell you products and basic financial planning, to really life-centered planning. Was that a good answer?
Fraser Jack (01:02:01):
Glenn Malkiewicz (01:02:01):
Didn’t sound too good.
Fraser Jack (01:02:04):
Yeah, yeah, of course. It’s interesting when you open your mouth and stuff just comes out. So talk to me about the process because I didn’t ask this back when I should have. How many meetings are you having with the client before say, you giving advice? A new client?
Glenn Malkiewicz (01:02:19):
Yeah. So it’s either one or two. So the initial meeting is, okay, initial meeting, client comes in, one of the first questions I ask is virtually to find out why they’re here? So they usually give me a good summary of that and then I’ll go into explain who Endorphin Wealth is, what our process is, so really setting the scene very quickly and the approach that we take to providing advice, so really understanding who they are and their history, before we start to look forward and what their goals and possibilities are. And then we ask about their financial situation. That’s kind of the last step of that initial meeting. And then quickly address how we can potentially help these guys. So that’s all done in meeting one. What I usually send out is the Endorphin proposal which goes into a bit more detail about the service that we provide, the advice that we can provide to help them, and what the cost will be to do that. So that’s all done, meeting one.
Glenn Malkiewicz (01:03:30):
Where they want the retirement coaching, that’s got to be a separate meeting, because that probably takes up to an hour or even 90 minutes.
Fraser Jack (01:03:39):
I was going to say that must take a while, yeah.
Glenn Malkiewicz (01:03:40):
Yeah. Because with that, you’re just facilitating the conversation. You’re just asking the questions. I reckon the client speaks almost 90% of the time during the retirement coaching sessions, but even with the initial meetings, you’re just facilitating. Asking the right questions changes everything and it gets the client to really open up. That’s the key. You’ve got to ask the right questions.
Glenn Malkiewicz (01:04:06):
So it’s either one or two meetings and then we present the advice in say, meeting three.
Fraser Jack (01:04:12):
Yep, yep. Okay. Very good. Now, back to the original programming. What tips do you give to planners on what they should be focusing on in 2020?
Glenn Malkiewicz (01:04:26):
You did send these questions. I should have prepared for this one. I think tip one’s probably to really the motivations as to why the client is seeking advice. As I was saying before, those reasons usually transcend simply building wealth. So really spend some time understanding who the client is and what they’re here for, before you jump into your own presentation about what you can do for the clients.
Glenn Malkiewicz (01:04:59):
So the tip I give in terms of that is obviously communication’s the strongest influence on an advisor’s ability to win the client’s trust and commitment, but I’ve found that good communication alone is not going to guarantee a relationship success. With every client that I work with, I start the conversation with the heart, and then I move to the head, and then I end back at the heart. What I mean by starting with the heart is that the first connection is on the basis of understanding of why the clients is seeking advice. And not just in fiscal terms, but philosophical terms. So why do they want their money to grow and what does that mean for their lives going forward? So that’s step one. I talked about from the heart to the head. Move to the head is really where you jump in and talk about possible strategies, discussing investments that may be appropriate and outlining how long this is all going to take, so the strategic side of things. Then really end the communication with the heart, by virtually finishing on a chord of hope. What you’re doing there is providing a defined finish line that the clients are moving towards, that’s aligned to their unique circumstances and their personal values. So giving the client hope that they’re moving towards a goal and they’ve taken a step towards, I guess you call it self-mastery and life quality, if that makes sense. So that’s tip one.
Glenn Malkiewicz (01:06:40):
Tip two’s all around this life-centered approach. I guess, if you want to change the dynamic of the financial relationship to a value that is most meaningful, what I think advisors need to do is really do that by changing the central question that’s been answered in the relationship. Just based on my experience, the core question driving the advice and planning world has been, do you or will you have enough money? If that’s the question that’s driving this profession, there’s little wonder that planners spend so much time validating asset allocations and investments and returns. Creating this never-ending cycle or dynamic where you need to constantly justify the value that you provide, which is if it’s all around investment advice, the research says that it’s really hard to replicate outperformance going forward.
Glenn Malkiewicz (01:07:42):
So to me, the big tip is that the central question as to why the clients is in front of you is it’s not do you have enough money, it should be are you getting the best life possible with the money you have? Lead with that approach and the advice that you provide, the clients will resonate with that a lot more, because it’s all about them and what they’ve told you. You will find that your clients will be much more engaged and you will walk out of your client meetings feeling satisfied and fulfilled as an advisor and you will feel like that you’re making a difference.
Fraser Jack (01:08:26):
Wow. Thank you. As you said before, more than money, more than money.
Glenn Malkiewicz (01:08:31):
Fraser Jack (01:08:32):
Mate, if you could go back in your own life and career and have a do-over and give yourself some tips along the way, what would you say to yourself?
Glenn Malkiewicz (01:08:41):
Probably just what I said before. When you jump into this profession, you think it’s all about money and shares and investments and indices and that kind of stuff. You obviously need to learn that. It’s an important component. I’m not forgetting the investment component of the advice that I provide. But for me, and there’s advisors out there that still do it and they probably do it very well, but the ability to stock pick and choose investments that you feel are going to be outperforming the index going forward, that was a real challenge for me, when I first started. I used to try and wow clients with my technical expertise.
Glenn Malkiewicz (01:09:29):
What I realize now is I was probably putting the clients to sleep. And going through our 12-step investment approach, it’s like I know clients want to know that you’ve got an approach or an investment philosophy within your firm, but they don’t need to know every single detail about how you choose this share over that share and that kind of stuff. I used to lead with this kind of stuff in my meetings, client meetings. Because I thought that’s what the clients wanted. But I’ve since realized they do want to know that, but not to that extent. That there’s bigger reasons why they’re there. So really just take the time to... we’re human beings. The person sitting across the table’s also human. Just treat them that way and treat them with respect and respect their assets and just do the right thing. It’s as simple as that.
Fraser Jack (01:10:35):
Yep. Glenn, thank you so much for coming on and sharing your words of wisdom. Of course, sharing your transformation and to the advisor you are today, appreciate it. If someone wants to continue this conversation with you, how’s the best way to get hold of you?
Glenn Malkiewicz (01:10:49):
Probably email me. It’s email@example.com. Or you can call me on just my mobile, 0466-773-320.
Fraser Jack (01:11:05):
Oh, that’s generous. Giving your mobile out.
Glenn Malkiewicz (01:11:08):
Oh, we’ll see how we go. I didn’t say I’d answer it. Yeah, but I’m happy to chat to anyone about the life-centered planning course that I’ve completed but also the life-centered approach and the return-on-life approach that I use with clients and the software that we use to do that as well.
Fraser Jack (01:11:32):
Fantastic. Thank you so much, Glenn. Really appreciate it, coming on the show. It’s been fantastic insights for everyone.
Glenn Malkiewicz (01:11:39):
Thanks Fraser. All the best, thank you.
Fraser Jack (01:11:41):
Thank you. If you haven’t already, I’d love you to subscribe to the podcast on your podcast platform of choice. And to continue the conversation, head over to our social media channels. We’ll catch you next time.
Disclaimer: This document is a transcription obtained through a third party. There is no claim to accuracy on the content provided in this document, and divergence from the audio file are to be expected. As a transcription, this is not a legal document in itself, and should not be considered binding to advice intelligence, but merely a convenience for reference.